Rex Hohlbein 0:01

This podcast contains potentially sensitive topics including strong language, drug and sexual abuse, as well as other conditions of human suffering. Listener discretion is advised.

Auntie 0:18

Women couldn't do what I did, I would say most women could, because it's a hard job. It's dangerous, of course, the inner have to know the law and yet we acuity because they don't arrest you as much. You know, they don't want to believe that you agree that you just have to know what you're doing. And it's it's a tough little job.

Rex Hohlbein 0:46

I'm Rex Holbein and welcome to you know me now, a podcast conversation that strives to amplify the unheard voices in our community. For the past 12 years, I have met and spent a great deal of time, with 1000s of folks living homeless, there have been countless life changing for me conversations, and friendships that were gained. Through those experiences. I learned how destructive and baseless the dehumanizing effects of the negative stereotype are against ordinary people who are really just like you and me. I want to remind all of our listeners that the folks who share here, do so with a great deal of vulnerability and courage. They share a common hope that by giving all of us a window into their world, they're opening an increased level of awareness of understanding and connection within our own community.

Auntie 1:44

I was born in 51. That's 1951 as the fourth child, there were six siblings all together. One boy five girls. And we were all blondes. We love cute.

Unknown Speaker 2:00

What where did

Unknown Speaker 2:01

you grow up? What city?

Auntie 2:02

White center?

Unknown Speaker 2:04

Okay, so you're from Seattle?

Auntie 2:05

Yeah, I'm from Seattle. Original.

Unknown Speaker 2:08

Yeah, same here.

Auntie 2:09

And I really don't know that. How old are you? Am I 70?

Speaker 1 2:14

How do you look good? You really look good.

Auntie 2:17

Thank you.

Speaker 1 2:18

So you're seven years, seven years old. You have all this life experience. And I would honestly say you've got more experiences than most. Right? I mean, you've lived. I think you've lived a pretty full life.

Auntie 2:30

I have pretty much enjoyed it. I do the same thing over again.

Rex Hohlbein 2:38

In this episode, I want you to meet auntie. I first met her when she was sitting on the back bumper of a truck in the sodo neighborhood in Seattle. She was bent over rocking back and forth, holding her wrist and wincing, obviously in a great deal of pain. When I came up to her, I asked her if she was okay and she said, I need to go to the hospital. I think my wrist is broken.

Speaker 1 3:08

At the hospital, we learned her wrist was fortunately not broken, rather only sprained. However, her vitals were not stable enough for her to be released. And because of it, she spent the next three or I think it was four days in a hospital bed there. In that short time of her hospital stay. She lost her RV. The one that was her home. It had been impounded, and with no funds to get it out. It was now simply gone. along with everything else she owned.

Rex Hohlbein 3:42

About a week later, I found Auntie again in the sodo neighborhood. She was now sitting on an old truck bench seat that had been pushed up against the cyclone fence along the railroad tracks. She was smoking a cigarette, just hanging out. When she saw me, she yelled out with joy. Like we had been friends forever, despite the fact that we had only met once. But this is the thing about auntie. She has a charisma and a charm to her when that she'll tell you has been with her her whole life and that she holds tight to using it when needed. By the time I met auntie, she was at the very bottom of her life journey. Being homeless, sick and in chronic pain, addicted to heroin, but still, unbelievably charming. Auntie now lives in subsidized senior housing. She sat down with me to share a bit of her interesting life story with all of you. You're a pretty positive person.

Auntie 4:44

Yeah.

Speaker 1 4:46

I mean, I've seen you in some pretty low times easier on me really bad. Yeah, sleeping on cardboard in the middle of winter on pavement. And and you were still smiling.

Auntie 4:59

She Get as my hands sit and dry, cuz it's gonna get you nowhere.

Speaker 1 5:04

I asked Auntie to begin by telling us about her childhood. You

Auntie 5:08

know, I was a girl, I'd say, Boy, I was a girl, but I was really tough. My brother was a year older than me, you know, just a year. So I learned to begin, you know, beat up him.

Unknown Speaker 5:23

So I was good. We're mom and dad a good pair, do they love each other. And

Auntie 5:29

if he didn't drink, they would have been a good pair, that he drank too much. And, you know, he'd set the bar and he and he would flirt. Mom told me to get in the car. She drove down to a bar. She seen him. I seen him. And she's got Jim in the backseat, you know, the station wagon. So I did. She goes, you keep your head down. Yeah, right. Goes by heads up like this one. And I'm watching it. My mom had a bus, that woman right off her seat that she didn't. She just picked him up by the ear and said that she she took care of him. She, you know, kept him in line kept him in mind. Yeah, when she had to. She was one beautiful lady. She took care of us all. And very nicely, I would say she didn't work. She stayed in the house with his kids. And my father worked. We live just like regular people. We didn't have no special things.

Speaker 1 6:32

Can you tell me one or two or whatever things that you loved about your mother?

Auntie 6:38

And you know, she was overweight, but I would always take my arms and put them around her waist and say, oh, yeah, you're using way you know. And I do that, you know, do check with her like that. Everyone's I didn't realize my arms are getting longer.

Unknown Speaker 7:02

Okay, that is very funny. As you are getting bigger, she was getting thinner. Did she laugh a lot? Was she?

Auntie 7:12

Yeah, she loved seeing that. She loved me a lot. I mean, I would get in trouble. And I get on restriction, of course. And then I would. I linked up to my mother. I go to work next to her. And I went to speak at all g8 it? She'll Okay, your authorisation? Okay, Mom, how you doing? You know?

Unknown Speaker 7:37

Cuz you were friends. And she wanted to talk

Speaker 2 7:39

with you. Yeah. Oh, yeah. leads us all the time. Your mother sounds wonderful.

Auntie 7:43

She was she was a happy go lucky people. I love her to death. But other words would come home. Stay out, get drunk. When you get home, maybe, you know I don't man. And he would do something. Throw the TV out the window. Or set money. Just go buy another one. Because he was a welder? Yes, he made good money.

Unknown Speaker 8:09

And he would just sometimes we would just throw the TV out the window. Yeah, cuz they

Auntie 8:13

were fighting when he came on the inside and easily throw the TV out the window. But we'd always be in the bedrooms. As kids we'd scatter.

Speaker 1 8:21

Was he? Was he violent that way other than just joining

Auntie 8:25

He didn't hit any of us. You know, he didn't hit my there. He just had to, he just had handed by throwing TVL he threw him out. Rock a pizza. So she, you know, she fought back. She you know, she was due to rise back. She was verbal. You know, she didn't hit him. There was no violence like yet, you know? So

Speaker 2 8:51

she was a tough She's a tough cookie. But yeah, she's a tough cook. No, like you can like me.

Speaker 1 8:57

When Auntie was 15 her mother became suddenly sick. It was a pivotal moment in her life.

Auntie 9:05

She when she went to the doctors, she was laying down at she was just sick. I got it gave her bad got her dressed to go across the street for she'd go the doctors and she might said premonition of something. Because she asked me What flower I liked the best and she just, you know, ask questions that you don't ask. And she made me promise to graduate and I wanted to go out and smoke so so I said he or she is gonna go but you know she I gave her a kiss she left and then next thing I knew I heard my father walking up the walkway. And he was crying. And he goes get up your mother just is dead.

He was very rude. It was very horrible the way he said it, you know, like he didn't even care. So that was a very tight moment for me. That yeah, I loved it very dearly. So I think she had pretty much she knew. And she, she got to the doctor's office. I guess she told the neighbor to stop. And so she had to catch your breath. And she's got, she stopped the car. She my mother got out of the car, stood up and then went right down to the ground. She died. She was boom, get dropped like and fly. It is horrible. You know, I I'm glad I didn't see it. That is one thing. I'm glad. You know. Yeah, I led my mom greatly. You know, she was a good woman. She passed away when I was 15. Yeah, so though family works, because I broke it up. I had to wait a minute.

Night that it was coming. He told me to get my mother's bed. Like I was gonna do that. I don't think so. What

Speaker 1 11:24

do you mean by he told you to get in your mother's bed? What does that mean?

Auntie 11:29

He was he was gonna crawl in and do me. Really? Yeah. I mean, I knew he was gonna rape me. And that's why I said, No way and I got out of there. You know, I mean, I was ready to fight him. He tried to push me in that bed. I pushed back at him. I didn't care. You know, he was not gonna rate me. He was not gonna put me in my mother's bed. You're fucking crazy, you idiot. You know, I flat back. Most girls though. But I fought back. And I told him to fuck off, you know, and I had to punch him. And I did. You know. And of course, I wasn't going to go do that. It's just I was not raised like that. My mother. You know, she taught us better than that. And, I mean, I was just smarter than that. And so you have to be able to put your foot down on certain things, you know, it caught my I got my little sister's added air. And I went to my other house. And we talked to the police and they were gonna put him in jail prison, that my grandma begged me not to do it. That changed everybody's life because I separated them completely. I would wouldn't let my sisters go back in the house you have once they stayed with my aunt, my uncle. For years. I went to Miami because but she got jealous of me. Because I had bigger boobs in her. So I went to the Youth Center. She put me in the center. And so I was here for like 44 days and 40 Nights. It wasn't bad if you ruled the nest and I ruined the nest, you know, in there. There was a girl wearing a pair of cut offs, and I wanted them so I took them. This one lady told her in there one girl said Do you know what she's in here for? And she says she's in here for fighting. Like people she knifed them. She told that girl that story. And so she didn't mess with me. You had a reputation? Yes, I had a reputation in there really? Best and share that is funnier in heck, I didn't know why they

Speaker 2 13:58

believed her. So you must have had some attitude. I

Auntie 14:02

could talk my shit. And I can talk. And I can follow through if I have to.

Rex Hohlbein 14:09

1967 was a really difficult year for auntie. She was just 15 years old and had to deal not only with the death of her mother, but also several weeks before the passing of her grandmother who she was very close to and was also living with the family. Additionally, before Auntie was moved to the youth center, only a few weeks after her mother died. Her father unbelievably remarried.

Auntie 14:40

We had dead except her because she moved into our house. And so that didn't work out too well. So we had to put her somewhere else so we put her in prison and just needing to deal with it. We got rid of it so we didn't have to.

Speaker 1 14:57

Okay, I gotta ask. You can't just let that One lie on the table. How is it that she ended up in prison?

Auntie 15:04

She was married to another man too. She married my father, she they were gonna get this money and love him and take it off. She

Speaker 1 15:13

was married to another man. Yes, but then pretended to be single and married your father and the whole thing was a scam.

Auntie 15:20

It was a scam. Yep, that's exactly what happened.

Unknown Speaker 15:24

And you and you, you guys all exposed it somehow? Well, I

Auntie 15:27

did because she thought I was a dumbass. 16 year old. She asked me to go along with her this day, is visiting her husband. Because she took me to his workplace. They were talking and I heard the talk. Even though I was sitting away from them. I cranked my ears up and listen, you know, really hard. We had to do something because we just didn't like the lady ditch. You know, as what I would call her. Because people like that. I just don't care about you know, in my world or anybody else's world. Yeah, that's just wrong.

Unknown Speaker 16:09

But she wasn't in love with your father. She

Auntie 16:11

was no she was stealing. Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. So yeah, no, she didn't love him. I don't think he loved her. It was just a woman in the house. He because he had never did with that a woman. And I mean, we, we could tell she was using him. I mean, you can see it, you can see what she was doing. She is planning a wedding. You know, they just seen him in a bar. And so this hit on him. You know, he lost his wife. That's what they did. They hit on people, because she was married to a couple other guys, as well.

Speaker 2 16:47

And your father was how did it hit your father? Man? Boy, he

Auntie 16:51

was not a happy man. He you know, he was hurt. You know, and he was pissed? Because she was only monitoring him for theft. And

Speaker 1 17:03

how are you doing? I mean, that's a lot to handle it. 1516 years old. Like you broke the family of B for good reason. Yeah, great. Listen. Yeah, for great reason. And, and then you go to a youth center. And you're 16. Right. Like, like, yeah, what? Like, can you share what your thoughts or feelings were during that time? Because I'm telling you, if I was doing that at 16, I probably would have spent half my time on the couch crying.

Auntie 17:30

No, I didn't have time for that. You just don't have time for some time. You just can't feel sorry for yourself when you have to figure out what you're gonna do. You know, so that's what I just did it, you know? But yeah, there was my inner game got me and I was, you know, if somebody loves me, you know, and they were good, too. Oh, yeah. Very good. Does mother's best friend. Cuz she's got to be good to me. Otherwise mother would have never liked her. Well, yeah, she was good to me. And Maynard was

Speaker 1 18:06

after Auntie moved in with Lois and Maynard, her life got a bit calmer and a bit more stable. They enrolled Auntie into school.

Auntie 18:15

They put me in school right away. And so I didn't miss a beat. Really? You know, I wasn't real smart. But I was smart enough that I worked on getting good grades. You know? It wasn't easy to me either. So but I knew I had to work hard. Then I'm in dude. And I married. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 18:38

And did you did?

Unknown Speaker 18:39

How old? were you when you married him?

Auntie 18:41

18.

Unknown Speaker 18:42

Yeah. And did you graduate? Did you get your high school diploma?

Auntie 18:45

Not at that time. But I was trying to go to school still and, and I was I changed schools, because I lived in a different area with him. And so I was I went to their 11th grade. And that's when I quit is in 11th grade. You know, why?

Unknown Speaker 19:06

Why did you drop out? Because it

Auntie 19:09

was just too hard. You know, it was getting just too much for me. So I just screw this. And I skated for a long time, you know, without getting a diploma, but I am fine. He went in and took, you know, the class. So I went in and I pass that test with the neck, you know, good eight. And that was just common sense. You know, though that was

Unknown Speaker 19:39

How old were you when you went back and did that? A yak Gatling?

Auntie 19:43

I was my 40s Yeah, but I got it.

Speaker 1 19:49

Because it was important to you what I mean, when you're, my mom made

Auntie 19:53

me promise to graduate. You

Speaker 2 19:56

know, you're keeping you're keeping your promise to your mom.

Auntie 19:59

So I kept that promise to her. Yes. You know, maybe in a little bit later in life that she expected that I got it. I wasn't pregnant when I got married. Because I wouldn't get married if I was pregnant. Because I would never have that, that a man say I had to marry you. There's just no way I would do that. Few my friends had to get married because they were pregnant, you know?

Speaker 1 20:25

Because you wanted to know that he was marrying you because he loved you? Yeah. Not because he was because

Auntie 20:31

he had to. Yeah, make sense. And I was just that kind of girl. And I didn't want around certain people. He and I had tried mine. And so as well as brought up, you know, till 16 And then, but, you know, I was faithful to my mom in ways that, you know, we lived, you know, people just don't do that down.

Unknown Speaker 20:56

Were you in love? Like really in love?

Auntie 20:58

I thought it was really a map. Yeah, that's quite a while.

Unknown Speaker 21:01

How long?

Auntie 21:05

12 years.

Speaker 1 21:07

Auntie and her first husband bought a house together and white center and had two children. But things changed when her husband got injured working at a heavy steel industrial shop.

Auntie 21:18

And then he just he pooped out on his youngness you know, he got hit in the head with sheer steel. And he was lucky there's two tables, still tables there. Otherwise, he would have been crushed. That it is happening. Blew his ears out. Hurting pretty bad. So he was laid up for a bit now as okay. You know, we I took care of him.

Speaker 1 21:48

So on to you. Your husband gets injured. And you guys are still in the house? What?

Auntie 21:56

We're still married. We were still married. Yep. And so we did the best to be happy that he, I mean, he went to work and that was bad. And I was working, you know, there for a while. He was fine. He made enough money. You know? And

Speaker 1 22:14

it sounds like eventually you got divorced. Yeah. Guys kind of fell out of love or?

Auntie 22:19

Yeah, it you know, it was it made sure I fell out of love with him. It was what it was. And I had to go. So I gave him everything. You know, I didn't want anything. Even though that was my dream home. He had said he was gonna kill himself. And I wasn't gonna have it, you know, he's not gonna put that on me. While

Speaker 1 22:44

still married to her first husband. Auntie became involved with another man.

Auntie 22:49

He was my good, my best friend's boyfriend for a while. So he was like family, they just put us together too many times, you know, made us do this together made that together. And so we just started doing things together. And he, you know, we look mostly during the bowling team they were supposed to be with right in with us, because we all decided we're gonna be bowling team. They didn't feel like it. You know, they pushed us together. You know, too much one thing leads to another and yet one thing does lead to another because he was my best. My Best Friend's Boyfriend. If he can understand that. Yep. And that her badly when we told her that we had to tell her you know, seeing each other and did

Unknown Speaker 23:44

you also tell your husband? Was that keep me

Auntie 23:53

close. And so you know, it was like guys naked you know, yeah, he walked in there. I was asleep and like a baby. And all of a sudden he jumps up me. You know? You didn't jump on the guy tried to beat the guy and he dragged beat me up that he didn't hurt me or anything. You know. He was very, very, very worried about that. My marriage was done. You know? I mean, and I'm glad it was you know, I literally got busted. Because in everything games. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 24:39

Life gets complicated, doesn't it? It

Auntie 24:41

is complicated that need Yeah, you don't go through that.

Speaker 1 24:47

Try to remember that. At this time in your life, Auntie was working as a preschool teacher and enjoyed her time with the kids. She really loved her job.

Auntie 24:57

Is that all they ever did? Were you good? I was very good at it,

Unknown Speaker 25:02

I would imagine actually.

Auntie 25:06

And then the kids loved you. They did. The teachers were jealous of me. Because I could go out and ask her anything. I didn't care. I was walking down the street, and they was coming out of the shop and they was wounded. And I go, Oh, if I bring a bunch of children down here, we'll detox them. And you know, so they'd say, Yes. And, and I did it to it. Fish it fish and chip shop over it, but okay. So I asked him if the classroom would come down. And he goes, Yeah, I can handle that. And they go, Okay, thank you. You know, my little cute voice. And

Unknown Speaker 25:46

we were

Unknown Speaker 25:48

you a charmer? Uh huh. Yeah, good, good.

Rex Hohlbein 25:54

In addition to being a preschool teacher, Auntie also had another job. She in fact, had a secret life that she kept from the outside world. To put it simply, Auntie was very good at selling drugs. She was a drug dealer. When asked about her earliest memories of being around drugs, she began by sharing that her parents allowed her to drink beer in the house from time to time, while growing up. It was then she realized she could make some side money by selling the beer, rather than drinking it.

Auntie 26:30

Highly take a beer. I get a six pack in a week. And I take it to school sell it, because I can make money that it's not like I was stealing. Because otherwise I would have drank it. You know, so I think he loves mine. So that's why you just turned it to cash me this made sense to me? And

Unknown Speaker 26:55

can you talk a little bit about the progression of that first beer? And then how did it move forward in your life?

Auntie 27:03

That we always had parties that I asked my husband and I so that was early on? When you know, right after we got married, you know, I just went into people and they give us the open shit. And pot, you know, and his, my husband had a friend. She was, you know, as we'd like, go for a ride with her. And I go Yeah, not a problem. And so jump in regard. She was at at big enough. pounds a dope.

Unknown Speaker 27:32

Nice, dope meeting marijuana. Yeah.

Auntie 27:36

And so, you know, I bought several pounds off her. I started selling meds and, and that's what they were called back then. Yep. I

Unknown Speaker 27:46

remember that.

Speaker 2 27:49

Yeah, so you're like, you are 20 years old or 1918? Yeah,

Auntie 27:54

I still 18. So I, you know, I just dug in pot selling but then I trade for this for that. I ran into a guy that sold speed. So of course, I bought that. And that was a good sale. That was easy money. You know, I mean, I got up to where I was buying a pillow.

Speaker 2 28:17

As feed pillows worth a pillow case?

Auntie 28:20

Yeah, yeah, that was I don't know what a pillow is. 1000s of pounds. Yeah.

Speaker 1 28:26

Did you have moments during the time selling drugs that that were both either very scary for you or just hilarious? Like, oh my god, I

Unknown Speaker 28:37

can't believe that happened. Oh, yeah.

Unknown Speaker 28:40

Can you share? Can you share a

Auntie 28:41

few of those stories? My husband and I got stopped. I think this is hilarious. It wasn't afraid. Because I had the dope hidden. It was 25 jars, I went to pick the victor that my husband was driving. And he insisted on driving the truck with no tags or a day you'd fired. And I just knew we're gonna stop. So I stopped the grocery store cars and let some food and you know, put them in a bag and there's potato stick sticking out and stuff like that. Like putting stuff in the bottom. And you know, the old grocery track. And it was this cup stop this. And I had this turn you shut up? Because he looks guilty. Yeah, let me do all the talk. I said you let me talk. You just keep your mouth shut. And so he did. He pulled and I go observe. It's my fault. I know. I just started booming out with dogging. And I go I'll make sure he gets him on Monday and bla bla bla bla bla and I mean, I think it's funny cuz I had it in there but I wasn't scared. I was happy and joyful to talk to God. I wanted to note was my phone that my husband said tags weren't on there. You know, I get stupid wife. You know, I took the rap for all that. And the cat just laughed. You know, he didn't write him a ticket. And I go, I promise I'll get them now. I mean, I could work the cops. They always let me do whatever I wanted to. In the eyes carry dope, right? And, you know, if you're nice and smile, they let you slide. Nice

Speaker 2 30:31

and smile gets you a long ways in this world which Amaya? Yeah. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 30:38

Did you ever get caught with

Auntie 30:40

drugs and go? Never? Yeah, no. I mean, I was so fortunate to have a good mouth. When was I picked up some dope or some other people. And so I picked it up quite a bit. And I had the kids with me. And boy didn't want to get caught. So I shoved it. You know, in places where you're not supposed to find it. And I had a Volkswagen. That's a little rough than I did. Yeah. And so, yeah, that was a scary one for me, because I had to move around to her agency, cause, you know, because they knew my you know, because they stopped me in it a few times wanted to date me in a few different cups did jerks. Going out with you? I'm married, you know, and they wouldn't believe that either. One that followed me home to know exactly where I lived. You know, he had my address, you know that a license? He took back? Persistent. It was crazy. So yeah, I am. I didn't see me or catch me and stop me nothing. So I went different routes.

Speaker 1 32:09

By the time Auntie was married to her second husband, she was really stepping up her drug dealing business, restarted

Auntie 32:16

selling cocaine. We said we sell drugs, and we're very good at it. And he really made money. And I can't meet my husband. for that. You know, it was something we both decided together to do. What

Speaker 1 32:36

was the, like, at the peak of selling drugs? What like, what is that like? Like? Well, how do you juggle all of the people the money, the worry about hitting very hard, sounds stressful to me, people

Auntie 32:48

lose it when they're taking the drug, you can't take the drug and sell it. Because you lose it, everybody loses it. Because a man will, you know, jump in bed with any of the women, they take their steel bill, and that's a common thing. You know, steal it, they get it, they take it and run with it. And the money to because you make a lot of money, you don't know where to stick it anymore, because you got so much all over the place. You know, and you put it in socks by I mean, right now, many of my husband socks all the time, we're talking a couple of grand, you know, because

Unknown Speaker 33:31

it's just flowing in, because

Auntie 33:33

you really need to have a bank account to put it in, but can't do that. Like, you know, because in the wild catch up with yet. And that's how they do. You know, common sense tells me a lot of things about traffic, you can't have traffic coming and going. So you have to make them stay for a certain amount of time. And then, you know, go quietly out, you know, and you know, they weren't allowed to be loud over at my house. You know, because any disturbances at all. So

Speaker 1 34:06

you weren't doing anything that caused a wrinkle. That people that people could then point to Yeah, no wrinkles, no wrinkles, wrinkle free zone. Yeah. So here's a question for you. There. There's a there's an image of a preschool teacher, right. I mean, and it's one of nurturing kids Yes. of teaching. Yeah. Helping. And then there's an image of a drug dealer, and they

Speaker 2 34:32

still sold drugs and they were selling drugs during that time. Yeah.

Auntie 34:35

Like nobody knew that. So how

Speaker 1 34:37

can you explain tight walk tightrope walking those two different worlds like,

Speaker 2 34:42

like, how do you get resident How do you explain that?

Auntie 34:47

I just did that in the evening. You know, people would come to my house. I'd sell it to him. Yeah, it was just, you know, I could do it. I could handle it. Because I kept my mind tight.

Speaker 1 34:58

You know, one of the things that I love hearing from you is the love that you have for your mother. Right? And the respect and, and also, you know, doing right by her you going in your 40s to go back and get your high school diploma. Yeah, get on a promise,

Auntie 35:15

I promise ALA and I did it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 35:17

And so so you're clearly a woman that, that, like, these things are important too. But to her, but at the same time, you, you know that drugs are ruining people's lives, let's

Auntie 35:32

say, oh, yeah, I watched it. And And

Speaker 1 35:35

Yet, You're a part of selling that. So how do you how do you get your head around that? Did you ethically or morally just keep the drug selling in a box then like it was something separated out from your life? Totally

Auntie 35:46

separate from my work? My family, I mean, I did it. My kids didn't know what I was doing. You know, I didn't tell them. We just had a lot of friends kept up by and they knew we had friends and appeared my the parents that classroom. They bought me. And so I kept that quiet for them. Because I didn't want them to get in trouble. And that was best me. It

Unknown Speaker 36:22

was a tight circle you were managing.

Auntie 36:25

And very quiet.

Speaker 1 36:28

I wanted to ask a tough question. And you know, I love you. So this is not a judging now,

Speaker 2 36:33

but but do you think?

Speaker 1 36:36

Do you have any ill feelings about the ethical side of having sold drugs? Do you ever reflect being a woman now of your age? Do you look back on and reflect?

Auntie 36:47

Or do the same thing over here's

Speaker 1 36:49

another thing do you think your mother if she was looking down with say, oh,

Auntie 36:53

she'd be pissed that she brought me up? That you're going to heaven night now? Are you going to hell? No. Oh, yeah. I apologized to her every year on her birthday.

Unknown Speaker 37:06

You apologize for having sold drugs. I apologize

Auntie 37:09

for being a bad girl for selling drugs. Now in any of that, because I did what I needed to do. And that's what I did. And I didn't hurt anybody. You know, if it was bad, no biting salad. You know? I wouldn't do I wouldn't hurt anybody. You know, and it probably did hurt some of them. And I didn't know about it. You know that? I wouldn't purposely hurt anybody. Yeah,

Speaker 1 37:40

I know that about you. So when you say you apologize for being a bad girl with What does? Does a bad girl.

Auntie 37:47

Bad girl sales jobs? Yeah, that girl does bad things. And so I did some dice. And that's it. So

Speaker 1 37:58

auntie, like, clearly all of this stuff is illegal. And how clearly clearly so how do you? You know, it's

Speaker 2 38:06

illegal? How do you stay level?

Speaker 1 38:10

How do you feel okay, with it being illegal? Like where? How does that line?

Speaker 2 38:14

I feel like you and I are daring. Yeah, but, but

Unknown Speaker 38:18

But it's okay. To break the law.

Auntie 38:22

To me. You know, how come? Because I'm good. Hey, and I never got caught at all. Never. Yeah. Because you were good. Because I was that good. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 38:35

but what about it just being wrong.

Auntie 38:38

I don't think it's wrong. To break the law. It's not breaking the law. To me. It's natural. It comes out of the earth. I should be able to do it. So your

Speaker 1 38:48

basic and I'm not saying that? I don't do the same thing. Right. Like when? When I'm on the freeway in the in the speed limit says 55. And I go 65? Yeah, I'm breaking the law. I know making a lot. So I'm what I'm really saying in that moment is I know the law says 35. But I don't think it applies to me right now. And it's not doing anybody any harm for me to go 65 Exactly. Is that how you feel about drugs? Yeah,

Auntie 39:12

they're the same. Yeah. Yeah. As long as I'm careful, and I don't hurt people. I don't kill them. You know, I don't overload them. Because people will take as much each give, you know, so then people take it all shooted that

Unknown Speaker 39:29

we're being careful with people very careful.

Speaker 1 39:31

Do you think now this would this would cut into the profitability of selling drugs, but do you think drugs should be legalized? Well,

Auntie 39:39

it was there would be so much shit going on that day that it wouldn't be as many homeless people. If they put locations where people could do drugs, you know? I think that would be okay. People can do it in their home. You know, so it wouldn't be so bad. had cut down on the crime, I think would totally cut down on crime. So yeah, I don't think it was, you know, I mean, they can control it just like they're, they're controlling pot right now. And other drug dealers shut down. They can't sell their butt anymore. So yeah,

Speaker 1 40:19

yeah, I know a lot of people actually on the street that are that used to sell pot and are, quite frankly pissed about it. So what you're saying is, if they can do it for pot, why don't they just do

Auntie 40:29

it for all the drugs? Yeah, for everything they can control that it's so good, the product would

Speaker 1 40:33

be cleaner, you know what it would be regulated? Yeah. And it could be controlled and taxed.

Auntie 40:38

It would be better though. They would, you know, sell it at a good price. So you know that they're making money, good money on it.

Rex Hohlbein 40:51

Somewhere along the way, Auntie developed a taste for the drugs herself. She took speed, snorted cocaine, and later started to shoot it. Both of her marriages fell apart, due to drugs, and, of course, the chaos of that lifestyle.

Auntie 41:08

And then my husband and I said he was doing here. I tried it once and I hated it. So this is not for me. Was and I broke that we were married for that we broke up after five years after marriage. Because, I mean, he slept with everybody in mind, you know what diseases he had or anything, but I never go back with him. Because once you once you do somebody that's used meat. Does that go? You know, he had sex with every one of the girls. He was a used car to me then used me is what I call it. Yeah. When a man that you're married to or boyfriend, whatever. If they do somebody else that use me. I don't want them. You know, they stuck somewhere nation to be in. Yeah, yep. So there he is when he was over, and I just walked out. Yeah, I was. I just walked away. Yeah, no, I did that with all of them. Yeah. I just walked away from them. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't want nothing.

Speaker 1 42:22

You've had some rough relationships with men. Do you have those two? Yep. I don't mean rough physical, but just you know, I think your father, obviously was out of bounds.

Speaker 2 42:35

Oh, yeah. Definitely drunk and tried to rape you? Oh, yeah. Yeah, molest me. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, do you do you have are men Good? Good. People are great.

Auntie 42:46

I love them. Yeah, you know? Yeah. And it was my own fault for getting in some of that trouble. You know, like, just, there's it was me too. You know, I mean, I

Unknown Speaker 42:58

takes too I was

Auntie 42:59

a good one for getting in trouble. Yeah, you know, you want to talk with me? I'll talk with you back.

Speaker 2 43:04

Yeah. Where did you learn that way that you fuck with me? I'm

Unknown Speaker 43:09

going to fuck with you back.

Auntie 43:10

Yes, my now led you there. And sometimes I had to prove it. Yeah, but I did it. No, I

Unknown Speaker 43:20

said it. I gotta I gotta back. Yeah, did

Auntie 43:22

that this shit up and I did. You know, you

Rex Hohlbein 43:26

know, like, part of what the you know, me know, podcast is trying to do is I mean, the reason I wanted to interview you is because I love who you are.

Speaker 1 43:39

I really do. I love our friendship. And I just I don't know, I enjoy talking to you and I and I, I I see the beauty in you like who you are as a human. Yeah,

Auntie 43:51

and I know that and I like that because you're not judging me.

Speaker 1 43:55

Yeah, not at all. I'm glad you said that. Because that leads into actually my question which is the reason you know me now is doing this podcast is for other people to see the beauty in someone that they might normally just judge right so yeah, so people are going to there will be there are so many people that here drug dealer and they they right away say they just check off my list. Oh, yeah,

Auntie 44:21

you dirty person. You, you. You you sell drugs to people you kill people. No, I'm not a killer. Thank you, you know,

Speaker 1 44:32

so this is my question. What like what would you say to what would you say to all those people who are judging you

Speaker 2 44:39

unfairly or incorrect use laughs at him. Yeah, but until what? Like not just laugh at them but

Speaker 1 44:46

like what would you say to them? Like to say hey, you know what, you're judging me incorrectly? Because I What would you say? What would what would? What would open their heart to actually see you? Most

Auntie 44:57

people do not take the time to listen You know, I'm just a drug dealer. You know, they just, she just wants me to buy drugs from her, you know, that the dealer is going to instantly if they touch him, they're going to be higher. So, you know, and they do. And that's why you get judged so quickly. But now, because of my now, people trust me, they let me into their home. And they don't judge me as a drug dealer. They don't see me as that because I don't portray that when I go into their home. I mean, really?

Speaker 1 45:36

Yeah, it's interesting, you know, like, even before you told me your story, you know, it'd be easy to have put all these judgments together. Right? But you have a you have a really beautiful energy about you, that disarms that Yeah. Yeah. And, and I think that's easily felt when you're near you. I wonder, what are the things that people need, that aren't near you that need to hear about you? Like, how do you define yourself? Like, if you were to say him in less than a minute, like who is Auntie? Who are you? Alright? I'm

Auntie 46:13

decent, friendly lady, you know? loves animals, you know, helps people out and they need it. The gardener, a gardener. My hobbies are, you know, gardening, bowling, you know, I enjoy doing that. And it's okay, for some I'm okay. You know, I'm normal. Okay. Yes, well,

Unknown Speaker 46:42

you're more than okay in my book, but

Auntie 46:43

nothing special.

Unknown Speaker 46:47

I actually think you are, but

Auntie 46:49

that's what I tell them. Nothing special. Yeah. But I know that I have my arm around me as well as my generosity with my person. You know?

Speaker 2 47:01

What did you say? Energy? You have your armor around you? Yeah,

Auntie 47:05

I always had the armor around me. What armor suit?

Unknown Speaker 47:08

Yeah, what is your armor look like, last

Auntie 47:11

night guns and swords or anything like that. But it is, you know, for I don't get hurt. Just, you know, I don't suck into everybody's shit. Yeah, because I know people shit. You know, I went through a lot. But I've always given that's one thing I've always done. If somebody needed food, I make food baskets right away. Take everything out of my house and give it to him. He wouldn't bother me.

Speaker 1 47:40

Would you recommend to somebody that was 18 to follow the same path, like, you know, hold down a side hold down a job, but then sell drugs on the side if they if they had your abilities if they

Auntie 47:53

wanted to. And if they had the right attitude and your

Speaker 1 47:57

answers consistent with something you said earlier about, which is you don't really have any regrets. You're you've feels like you've followed your conscience. You had a you had rules for yourself and you followed them. Yeah. And, and some of the behavior was doing illegal drugs selling but it fell into, you know, a view that said if you weren't harming somebody, and you were taking care of the people that you were helping or serving drugs to selling it, it worked. It

Auntie 48:29

would it functioned very well.

Rex Hohlbein 48:34

For a period of time, Auntie moved out of the state, first to Florida, and then South Carolina. At that time, she was also experiencing a number of health issues. She had multiple leg surgeries, a knee replacement and some serious back issues that took a toll and contributed to major chronic pain. A doctor in South Carolina tucked Auntie into getting a pain pump that automatically dispensed Dilaudid, which is a synthetic narcotic in the opioid class of drugs. One that is highly addictive. During that time, to make matters even worse, Auntie was robbed in her home and severely injured. She spent a great deal of time in the hospital, going through physical therapy, actually learning how to walk again. Ultimately, she ended up back in Seattle living with a relative, but that living situation was not working out. In fact, it was no longer safe for her to stay there. By then, the pain pump was also not working. And Auntie started to use small amounts of heroin to control her chronic pain. She did not want to be a burden on her children. So she bought an RV and started to live in it at the age of 64.

Auntie 49:55

Yeah, I had the RV and I lived in it for two years. is

Speaker 1 50:00

so like from 215 to 218. Kind of an odd Yeah,

Auntie 50:04

yeah. I met you. Right in that area. Yes. That was doing dope in there for a few years.

Speaker 1 50:11

So this was Soto right. Yeah. Okay, let me tell you what I remember what how we met. You did told me there was a woman that I should meet. And and you were sitting on the back back bumper of a guy's kitchen. Yeah, yep. And you had said that a guy that you were staying with in our vo yet had

Auntie 50:34

to up he beat me up yet? Yep. Yeah. Yeah, he put me under. He helped me with my pet. It had an open tender blanket. And it's like this to my head. You know, and he wanted to do it tomorrow. He let me walk across the street. And he goes, you get over my camper right now. And you get in it. Yeah, right. That's just what I'm gonna do. Because I want more abuse. Yeah, I want you to hit me some more. Your heroin

Unknown Speaker 51:05

use is probably ramping up. You are starting to use more and more heroin.

Auntie 51:08

No, I never went to more I please. 10 in the morning, and 10 in the evening. I never ever use more net. I see What does 10 mean? And 10 tenten. Is $10 worth it? It depends on how much water you put into it. Is how many units you get your you're doing? Yeah. I guess needed for the pain. You know, so it took the Jaina

Unknown Speaker 51:34

because the pain pump had stopped working.

Auntie 51:36

Yeah, deduction. He fired me. Oh, that's right. Because

Speaker 2 51:40

you stopped paying making payments yet the payments. Yeah, so they just they just cut it off. Yeah, he's

Auntie 51:45

yet right when it ran out.

Unknown Speaker 51:48

I see. Yeah.

Auntie 51:50

man out. That's all he uh, yet. So that's why I went to him. I mean, as there's so much pain when the pump ran out. Oh, boy, did he hit me like a brick wall. And you had to go back to there. Like you said, Get me heroin, get me some heroin, because I needed to take away the pain. So Amen. Yeah.

Speaker 1 52:15

So you know, what's interesting about hearing your story is that, for whatever reason, I thought you had been homeless for years and years. But when I met you, you were really experiencing homelessness as a new part of your life. I mean, this was pretty new. A new chapter. Yeah. How did that go for you? Like what? Like,

Auntie 52:37

I had to do it. I had to do you see me?

Speaker 2 52:40

You heard just something else. Don't have time to worry about it. Just I gotta do it, do it. So

Unknown Speaker 52:49

I mean, can you explain any of that, like, like, I know, you're a can do person, but I

Auntie 52:52

had, like, I had IV. And then, you know, like, all these things were happening to me. Either, like, my leg was broken. I was hit by the car for that. But just different things kept happening to my dog, you know, and leaves that she just won't die.

Speaker 1 53:18

I remember when I met you, right? You're, you're you were in so much pain with your wrist and and I said you need to go to the ER. So I drove you. I said you want to Harbor View? No, I didn't take you to Harvard. You to Virginia Mason. Yeah, and I remember you

Speaker 2 53:39

know, I just met you. Yeah, when I get sent to you and and

Speaker 1 53:43

we're on the freeway and I five hidden north. And you rolled the what you said you said I'm gonna you look at me go I'm gonna throw up I'm gonna throw up. Yeah, and a lot of pain. Yeah. And I and I'm thinking, God, I just met this woman, girl all over my car. So I quickly rolled lowered the window. And you you just kind of leaned your head out and then just threw up over the whole side of the car and out the window. And I remember there was a car on the other in the other lane and they're just looking over at you thinking okay, this is a scene.

Auntie 54:17

Yeah, let me get on camera splat splat on their windshield. Yeah, I had you I mean, I wanted to get up go out a little further. But you told me not to. I remember that as well. I didn't want to go out the window. And then you said I like you. Area bugle on your car.

Speaker 1 54:40

So after that, you you lost your you didn't have an RV because no when you when you were released from the hospital, I think you were there for a few days. Were

Auntie 54:51

Yeah, they took one away from me the cups today. Yep. Yeah. And then

Unknown Speaker 54:57

did they take it away from you when you were or is

Auntie 55:00

in the hospital for days nice

Speaker 2 55:03

get now. And then when he got out he was gone. And they had taken again. Yeah. You know when I

Speaker 1 55:09

when I came to look for you after you got out of the hospital you were you were down in Soto along the railroad tracks there. Yeah.

Auntie 55:16

And there was a couch in the backseat.

Speaker 1 55:19

Oh yeah, it was. It was the backseat of a car and sit in their RV. Yeah. And I remember when I was talking to, you know, like asking you, where are you going to go? How are you doing? You know, and you say, Well, I'm just going to sleep right here. And as you were saying it I was looking over your head out to the West and out over West Seattle, there was a giant black rain cloud coming. And I said his I remember saying to you, auntie, it looks like it's going to pour rain here. What do you read? What are you going to do? And when it when it starts raining and you look at me go, I'm gonna get wet.

Speaker 2 56:00

is excellent. Okay.

Speaker 1 56:06

But, but I, you know, there were a couple other times I came to visit you when you were outside on the pavement in the winter sleeping on cardboard. You had a girl?

Auntie 56:17

Yeah, that was over mania. Yep. Oh, really cover blankets. They were heavy.

Unknown Speaker 56:22

And yeah, but still,

Speaker 1 56:24

I just I really couldn't understand how you were doing it. And here's what here's where I'm going with this, too. Is leading to a question. The picture you just showed me of you. How old were you in that picture? You look pretty young.

Auntie 56:37

Oh, I was like, like, 1925 25 Maybe? Maybe?

Speaker 1 56:43

Right? Like, like, you look like he looked like he just gotten out of college. I look at that picture. And I see a different person. And when you look back on your life, did you live the life you were going to live? Or Did it surprise you? Like,

Unknown Speaker 56:59

did you Oh, I

Auntie 57:00

got surprises.

Unknown Speaker 57:03

But I mean, could you have just as

Unknown Speaker 57:06

easily been a nurse at the hospital and live that I get

Auntie 57:09

to never been a nurse that I could have easily been a machinist

Unknown Speaker 57:15

and been completely

Auntie 57:17

to add satisfied. Yeah. That that may lead to burnout on that. I guess I have to have an adventure. I have something to do.

Speaker 1 57:28

I'm I'm just wondering how you ended up living this life? Like what turned it to that. And I also learned

Speaker 2 57:38

it to to a life of basically junk data drug

Speaker 1 57:42

dealer and and also, you know, a pretty

Auntie 57:47

gypsy?

Speaker 1 57:48

Well, you know, when I saw you homeless, I mean, I really was worried for you. I know almost every night. I mean, you were you were really?

Auntie 57:56

I got your real No, no, I did. Yeah. That I wasn't gonna quit. Yeah, you know, I could quit. I mean, I laid in the rain a little bit. But you know, people would have taken care of me. I know that

Speaker 2 58:11

you are such a survivor. Yeah. You have to be do you

Speaker 1 58:17

do the life you you have lived to this point? Is it? Is it a life that you have any regrets with?

Unknown Speaker 58:27

It again? You do it? You

Unknown Speaker 58:28

do exactly the same way? Yeah. Yeah. I just want to say you said yes. With a big smile on your face. Yeah.

Auntie 58:36

Because I would. If I didn't live this life, I wouldn't have been there to do that. So yeah, I enjoyed my life, because otherwise I wouldn't have done it. You know, I didn't say something that what I did, you know, in my life, it may not been what they would have did that is what I you know, and I would do it again. You know, I don't want to sit on a pedestal and let somebody else do what I need to do. Yeah, I guess that's where I would say it. And you have to be tough. He, you know, anybody that any girl that is out there on the streets. And, you know, they have to be tough, or they're not gonna make it. You know, they have to be honest with themselves to say, if they're not up there, they'll lose and they will lose that battle. They don't get tough and they're just gonna I don't want to say they're gonna be great, but they're just not going to add it fulfilled life dream that they could have.

Rex 1:00:05

Like if if there were three people here that they got to be a part of this conversation, and you shared all this that you were a drug dealer. And they were kind of really put off by all that, like, what would you say to them to say? Like,

Auntie 1:00:20

you don't know it unless you tried it? And I'd say, Don't put judgment on me. You have no right to? Because they don't. Right. Say that to anybody. You know, this is what I did with my life. What did you do with yours? And I would ask him that. And I see what they said. And there's probably a lot of things they did that they don't think was bad. That into me, maybe it was. Yeah. So I just never worry that things like that. I know what I've done. And I've seen that done a lot of things.

Rex Hohlbein 1:01:05

I want to stop and take a moment to reflect on aunties question, a question really for all of us, which is, if you're judging my life, tell me what you have done with yours. She goes on to say, there are probably a lot of your actions that you don't think are wrong, but to her and to others, maybe they are. I don't think Andi is just saying defensively, judging her is like the tea kettle calling the pot black. I think she is looking for more than that. She's pointing out that we all have parts of our lives that others disagree with, and that we should not simply fall into quick judgment. Rather, can we come together to find shared truth? I think it is at the center of why Auntie wanted to share her story. Life is always more complicated or gray than the black and white world we often want it to be. We do need each other and all our different views to find our way through the gray. This conversation, for sure, is not meant to define the lines of right and wrong. That's for all of us to work through. Rather, it is just asking us to stop and reflect on the complexity of life and give space for each other on the issues we differ on. Drugs are a polarizing force in our society. Some believe there should be zero tolerance for drug users and dealers, while others such as Auntie believe that all drugs should be made legal. Listening to each other is the first step in finding the shared truth. Auntie feels she has lived a good life guided by her love of people. She knows she has pushed the edges of what society approves of, but also that she has held true to her own sense of what is right and wrong. Her own code of ethics. She says without reservation, she has no regrets.

Speaker 1 1:03:12

So you're 70 and you're going to live to 90 or maybe 100 Sorry, I didn't mean 1400 What my goal is all right. That's excellent. So that's that's 44 more years. What are you gonna do?

Auntie 1:03:25

I'm just gonna be that girl now that you sell drugs, but that but if I had to, I would. Yeah, you know, I would I'd be out there in a minute doing the same thing. But you don't have to say good. I don't have to. Yeah. So

Rex 1:03:39

what do you have goals? What do you want? I know you're a gardener. I know you love taking care of B and hanging out with B. Yeah. And you got lots of friends in this building. I know because you make friends everywhere you go.

Auntie 1:03:54

Right. Cruise ship I could talk that damn. Captain into let me drive that boat

Rex Hohlbein 1:04:10

you know me know is produced, written and edited by Tomasz Biernacki and me Rex Holbein. We would like to give a heartfelt thanks to Auntie for sharing a little about herself with all of you. Join the conversation on the eunomia now Facebook page and our website at www. God you know me now.com Where we have posted a short, humorous audio clip of when Auntie found out she had died on our web page or also other stories of folks. We feel you should get to know. Thanks for joining in